Thursday, 2 February 2012

The Ortho-square? - fruit of hubris?

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The Orthosphere notion was doing reasonably well, it seemed, until we named ourselves.

Immediately Daniel at Out of Sleep ceased blogging, a few days later Bonald at Throne and Altar threatened to slow down blogging soon (hasn't happened yet...) and now the man who suggested the concept of a 'sphere' - Proph at Collapse: the blog, has put us on notice that he will become an infrequent blogger...

So what began vagely resembling a sphere - or more like a cube - is now a two-dimensional object - an ortho-square of daily-bloggers; or, if Bonald fulfils his threat, an ortho-triangle...

(And this includes unilaterally forcing the label upon View from the Right and Thinking Housewife.)

The new article in Brussels Journal called Rise of the Orthos

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/4904

was, it seems, written just in time - because at this rate there will soon be nothing much left to write about!

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14 comments:

  1. In my defense, I'm only considering it!

    In support of your point, however, the anthology idea appears to have flopped.

    So maybe we're stuck in the present arrangement forever -- living up to our enemies' caricatures in the process!

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  2. Whoa, Hoss; back this truck up! Just because ortho-bloggers are developing real-life responsibilities doesn't mean they’re no longer interested in the subject material. I’d frankly *rather* see all these guys getting married, having families, getting involved in local politics or organizations, etc., and spend a little less time blogging. (Make no mistake: if you’re the type to enjoy setting your thoughts out on a blog, you can never quit entirely.) And others will catch the passing torch, anyway; I think a self-sustaining movement has been created. Fruit of hubris? Not hardly.

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  3. "And others will catch the passing torch, anyway; I think a self-sustaining movement has been created."

    I'd like to think so. My daily traffic would seem to suggest as much. On the other hand, the fact that many of my commenters are douchebag atheists who hate my guts would suggest this movement is more besieged than self-sustaining!

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  4. As one who has from childhood considered priestcraft evil, and regicide it's own reward, but has never believed in equality or rights; I find these blogs fascinating and interestingly instructive.

    Please don't stop the fascinating flow of ideas. Many of them are very good indeed, and quite relevant to our apocalyptic times.

    I wonder how many of you here have read Stirner and Cioran?

    I like to read eloquent and well thought out ideas that I disagree with. It is after all what brought me here to these pages.

    If you want to understand your moral enemies (individualists and nihilists) as they understand themselves, then read Max Stirner and Emile Cioran.

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  5. Sorry to hear that. I have been traveling. The Ortho thought is badly needed in a crazy world like ours.

    The fact that most blogs end after several years is well known. People lose enthusiasm, they think they have said what they wanted to say, move on with their lives...

    It takes two or three years to do that.

    A movement only survives if new blogs appear.

    For example, I happen to be one of the oldest readers of the manosphere. Circa 2004, the most important blog was "Eternal Bachelor" but it is long gone.

    Then, Roissy appeared. But Roissy has been stalled and repeating for the last couple of years.

    Now Dalrock and other blogs are in full motion...until when?

    From the manosphere I came to the Orthosphere when I reached the conclusion that modernity cannot be reformed. There is something rotten in modernity.

    The problem with the Orthosphere is that there are so few blogs. A movement consisting of one hundred blogs is sustainable. A movement consisting of ten blogs is more prone to risk when some blogs retire (as they eventually do).

    Imnobody

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  6. @Imnobody - well, if the Orthosphere ever did become a movement, become socially influential, it would be crushed like a bug. Indeed, that will probably happen anyway - but it could be a step in the right direction. Blogs are part of the mass media, continual expansion of which is sustaining the nightmare. When the mass media goes down so will blogs.

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  7. For example, I happen to be one of the oldest readers of the manosphere. Circa 2004, the most important blog was "Eternal Bachelor" but it is long gone.

    I used to read that one, too! I haven't thought about ol' Duncan Idaho for years and years. He was my first intro to the manosphere, back when I vaguely knew there was something "wrong" with young women today but didn't have a clue what it was, or why.

    From the manosphere I came to the Orthosphere when I reached the conclusion that modernity cannot be reformed.

    Me too.

    The problem with the Orthosphere is that there are so few blogs. A movement consisting of one hundred blogs is sustainable. A movement consisting of ten blogs is more prone to risk when some blogs retire (as they eventually do).

    I'm not convinced that this is as much of a problem as people think - provided that all the current great blogs stay up. Over the past several decades one of the biggest problems for people who otherwise might have been inclined towards our ideas has been simply that there was no readily accessible source material to draw on. This doesn't have to be the case anymore. I've argued in other similar discussions, and maintain, that quality is much more important for us than quantity.

    well, if the Orthosphere ever did become a movement, become socially influential, it would be crushed like a bug.

    I am not convinced of this either. There's a lot of (quasi-) conspiracy-theorizing in the alt-right, but I tend to believe that powerful individuals and organizations have rather less power than many folks imagine. I see the trajectory of the West over the last century or so as less of an orchestrated change, controlled by shadowy figures, than a meandering wave that happens to have taken a certain direction. If the orthosphere could gain traction, we could direct that wave in a different direction, one that might wash over our foes in spite of their seeming power. No one yet has the power to command the ocean! This is my view, anyway.

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  8. "If the orthosphere could gain traction, we could direct that wave in a different direction, one that might wash over our foes in spite of their seeming power."

    Yes. Modernity is a Potemkin Village, and the wind is picking up.

    To mix metaphors still further, I like to think of us as the rudder at the tip of the larger rudder at the tip of the main rudder. In really huge ships, the main rudder is so huge that it needs a rudder of its own to get it moving in the correct direction, and sometimes the subsidiary rudder needs a sub-subsidiary rudder. So I hope we can be the sub-subsidiary rudder.

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  9. "I am not convinced of this either."

    Really? Some of us anonymous bloggers would almost certainly get fired if our identities were discovered (Bonald's at far greater risk than me -- I could get around this by scrubbing some of the crap I've written about soldiers, although caching may preserve them). If that happened, blogging would overnight become a much less pressing concern.

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  10. @ Samson J - Proph is right. The risks are very real - although of course in a totalitarian society nobody is actually safe, anyone (guilty or innocent have no meaning) can be denounced and punished.

    People are fired for being merely accused of 'hate crimes', for merely being the subject of a complaint; despite being found completely innocent - they and their employers are tainted by the accusation, and the organization wants rid of this taint.

    This kind of thing happens a lot in the UK - I know of several examples personally. The idea of 'innocent until proved guilty' has been reversed over the past couple of decades - both in law and within corporations.

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  11. I'll weigh in here, Bruce. I'm no shrinking violet, and I have no desire to be coddled like a baby (well, strike that, I have no desire to let people SEE me wishing to be coddled like a baby).

    The "Orthosphere" thing was tangential to my decision to put blogging on hold. But it was not wholly unrelated. I admit I bristle at labels (don't we all?). I wish — as I am sure you wish — to discover and write the TRUTH, labels be what they may.

    For my own part, I can say that the moment of feeling labeled and part of some "group" gave me a very subtle, but sickly, feeling of democracy, modernity, and popularity (vile things all!). Now, that's not to say it's a bad thing, and really I had my own stuff going on which led me to stop blogging, but since you brought up the subject... yes, it did have at least a small amount of influence.

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  12. I'm not convinced that this is as much of a problem as people think - provided that all the current great blogs stay up.

    This is the problem. An Ortho blog is not written by an organization but by a person. And blogging is not a basic function of human nature so you cannot assume that a blog stays forever. The person can die before his time, can have kids so he has no time to blog, his thought can evolve in other directions, an illness or a demanding job can hinder their ability to blog.

    This is why it is important that, for each blog that stops, there is, at least, another blog that appears.

    I don't have easy answers to this but it might be a good idea try to associate with Edward Feser. His blog has a lot of commenters.

    I know that Bruce's position towards philosophy is different to Edward's position.

    I find "classical theism" hard to swallow too. It seems to me not authentically Christian but mostly Greek (although the official theology of the Catholic Church backs it up).

    But Edward is aware of the problems with modernity and I would like to see the word "Ortho" on his blog. It would open a larger audience for us.

    Paul did the same when he brought the Gospel to non-Jews.


    Imnobody.

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  13. "Some of us anonymous bloggers would almost certainly get fired if our identities were discovered"

    The historical standard is painful death, i.e., martyrdom. The comment above is itself a symptom of the 'liberalization' of our sentiments, orthospherists included.

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  14. Proph is right. The risks are very real - [etc]

    Well, okay, fair enough; you make good points. But I stand by my "wave" theory (and Kristor's metaphor). I just can't help thinking that if we're small, we escape notice; and if we're big enough to merit "attention", then we'll be big enough to find people on our side who will employ us (for example).

    I suppose my cheeriness these days comes from having battled the despair, lain bound and helpless in its pit, and re-discovered God in the bottom of the darkness.

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